Murdered soldier was a local lad

Hinch Thu May 23, 2013 5:57 pm

Watch RO. News report to follow shortly

Charly Thu May 23, 2013 6:32 pm

I've just read the news on teletext, 25 year old lad Lee Rigby from Langley had a 2 year old son

Jeanie Thu May 23, 2013 6:47 pm

Just so very sad what a cruel world we are living in His poor family must be devastated prayers for all of them and for Lee.

Hinch Thu May 23, 2013 7:07 pm

http://www.rochdaleonline.co.uk/news-features/2/news-headlines/80554/murdered-soldier-named-as-lee-rigby-from-langley

Guest Thu May 23, 2013 8:06 pm

Hinch wrote:http://www.rochdaleonline.co.uk/news-features/2/news-headlines/80554/murdered-soldier-named-as-lee-rigby-from-langley

Deepest condolences to the family, friends and colleagues
of this soldier.

https://en-gb.facebook.com/HelpforHeroesOfficial

http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/

Poppyanna555 Thu May 23, 2013 10:05 pm

So tragic, his baby boy will never know his daddy. R.I.P Lee x

cyfrifia Thu May 23, 2013 10:57 pm

Mojo Hill wrote:

Deepest condolences to the family, friends and colleagues of this soldier.

https://en-gb.facebook.com/HelpforHeroesOfficial
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/

And, I would like to add my respect and condolences too.

Atlas Fri May 24, 2013 12:56 am

Mine also. I suspect it was the nature of this 'killing' that is upsetting most people, an unarmed off duty soldier thinking he was safe on the streets of his own country and suddenly finding himself set upon and unable to fight back in the manner he had been taught to do and having little to no chance of saving his own life.
These people who do these sorts of things are without doubt unbalanced with a warped moral outlook who see nothing wrong in the distinction of warring combatants. They would no doubt use the excuse that their methods of war and the killing of the enemy (as they see them) are no worse than the 'west's' use of robotic drones hurling death and destruction by winging missiles from the heavens without warning - which to some extent may have merit - and thus are no worse in their methods and objectives than the MoD or the Pentagon. But I'm not so sure. Sad

cyfrifia Fri May 24, 2013 4:00 pm

An un-named spokesperson for the The Rochdale Council of Mosques, making a statement about the murder, starts off fairly well, but lapses into a tirade about the BNP and EDL, which is not really appropriate.

http://www.rochdaleonline.co.uk/news-features/2/news-headlines/80560/rochdale-council-of-mosques-condemns-murder-of-lee-rigby

Poppyanna555 Fri May 24, 2013 4:30 pm

I honestly don't see anything in this statement that can be described as a 'tirade' Cyfrifia. Yes, they have touched on the BNP and EDL but they probably do have a right to be wary of repercussions from these groups in the aftermath of this terrible incident.

cyfrifia Fri May 24, 2013 5:12 pm

Depends how you read it, it reads rather as though whoever it is, is calling for the EDL and BNP to be purged from society with the full force of the law. Whoever it is is entitled to that view, but now is not a brilliant time to express it.

Perhaps that's not what was meant. Perhaps I'm a bit touchy, after the butchery yesterday. A simple 'sorry for your loss' would have been better at this time.

Spartacus Fri May 24, 2013 6:57 pm

cyfrifia wrote:Depends how you read it, it reads rather as though whoever it is, is calling for the EDL and BNP to be purged from society with the full force of the law. Whoever it is is entitled to that view, but now is not a brilliant time to express it.

Perhaps that's not what was meant. Perhaps I'm a bit touchy, after the butchery yesterday. A simple 'sorry for your loss' would have been better at this time.

"A simple 'sorry for your loss'" would not have been satisfactory as far as I am concerned, Cyfrifia. Would the "your" be referring to Drummer Lee Rigby's family, this country or none Muslims?

Rochdale Council of Mosques had to make a strong statement and I think they put some thought into the one they have made. Particularly:

""May Allah – God Almighty give such people the greatest of punishment in this world and the hereafter.

"May Allah – God Almighty help the family of the victim through this difficult time. Our deepest condolences and prayers for all those directly and indirectly affected." "

However, the reference to the EDL etc. would have been far more acceptable if RCM had also addressed the existence of the "hate preachers" who also consider themselves Muslims and who preach in the Mosques with the full blessing of their Muslim communities. One of these so called hate preachers knew the killers of Drummer Lee Rigby very well indeed.

I would very much like to see such a statement condemning these Preachers from Rochdale Council of Mosques and other Muslim Councils throughout the length and breadth of the UK. After all, these killers were radicalised by someone and these "someones" need routing out of the communities they live and preach amongst without any further delay. Time for some action for within the Muslim communities themselves.

Poppyanna555 Fri May 24, 2013 7:35 pm

I agree that their statement could easily be open to misinterpretation Cyfrifia, however, I do agree with your comments Spartacus re' the 'Hate Preachers'.
You are correct, the way I see it is that Muslims have been and still are far less at risk from the actions of the BNP/EDL than the rest of society is from radicalisation.

* Actually, upon reading the RCM statement a couple of times more, I realise that I thought they were calling for the two evil men who committed this appalling act to be dealt with the full force of the law etc but, it does say 'such people' and so does appear to be aimed more at members of the BNP/EDL?

cyfrifia Fri May 24, 2013 8:30 pm

Yes, Spartacus, the "your" was referring to Drummer Lee Rigby's family, friends, regiment, home town, and everyone who feels his murder as being a loss. That's a lot of people.

The Council of Mosques statement, as reported, is a bit wriggly, but, whether that's down to what they, whoever 'they' are said, or how it's reported or phrased, I don't know.

Guest Fri May 24, 2013 11:46 pm

Spartacus wrote:

"A simple 'sorry for your loss'" would not have been satisfactory as far as I am concerned, Cyfrifia. Would the "your" be referring to Drummer Lee Rigby's family, this country or none Muslims?

Rochdale Council of Mosques had to make a strong statement and I think they put some thought into the one they have made. Particularly:

""May Allah – God Almighty give such people the greatest of punishment in this world and the hereafter.

"May Allah – God Almighty help the family of the victim through this difficult time. Our deepest condolences and prayers for all those directly and indirectly affected." "

However, the reference to the EDL etc. would have been far more acceptable if RCM had also addressed the existence of the "hate preachers" who also consider themselves Muslims and who preach in the Mosques with the full blessing of their Muslim communities. One of these so called hate preachers knew the killers of Drummer Lee Rigby very well indeed.

I would very much like to see such a statement condemning these Preachers from Rochdale Council of Mosques and other Muslim Councils throughout the length and breadth of the UK. After all, these killers were radicalised by someone and these "someones" need routing out of the communities they live and preach amongst without any further delay. Time for some action for within the Muslim communities themselves.

Spartacus: Imam Irfan Chishti appears to be the spokesperson for the Rochdale Council of Mosques. He was on the Regional television news today and seemed to be asserting that the terminology ‘Islamic extremists’ needs annulling, akin to acts of fanatic violence .. like that of the murder of soldier Lee Rigby, which Chishti appeared to put forward as immoral criminality and nothing to do with Muslims / Islam.

Tory minister Baroness Warsi said the situation had been unnecessarily inflamed by giving "air-time" to Muslims with extremist views by broadcasters, including preacher Anjem Choudary. "We all have a responsibility, including the media, not to give airtime to extremist voices – idiots and nutters who speak for no one but themselves," she said.

Just one example was Anjem Choudary, the former head of banned Islamist organisation Al Muhajiroun, who was given a slot on Thursday's BBC2's Newsnight ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JDwUpv90QEE ) and on Channel 4 News.

An internet crawling with accessible 'Hate Preaching' videos by overseas radicals who are banned from this country must surely add to the availability of extreme rhetoric and influences.

Admin Sat May 25, 2013 9:31 am

This thread is intended to be a tribute to a brave soldier who was killed on the streets of our capital city, not a diatribe against Islam or multi-culturalism. These issues can be explored on other threads.

This is to remember and pay tribute to a young man; father a two year old lad and because he was local, could have been our father, brother, son or friend. He and his family are worthy of our respect.

The Mods have pulled a couple of posts to try to keep the thread within context.

cyfrifia Sat May 25, 2013 10:17 am

Murdered soldier was a local lad _67792245_candles1

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-22651472

Guest Sat May 25, 2013 11:43 pm

Remembrance services, local and national respect and tributes are palpable:

The charity for injured servicemen and women is inundated with donations following the brutal murder of Drummer Lee Rigby.

Woolwich: ' Help For Heroes ' Raises over £100,000

http://news.sky.com/story/1095455/woolwich-help-for-heroes-raises-100000.

http://www.justgiving.com/RIP-Woolwich-Soldier-FacebookPage; ---- https://www.facebook.com/pages/RIP-Drummer-Lee-Rigby/173237622841518

Guest Fri May 31, 2013 10:52 pm

Children to lead Manchester Day parade salute to Fusilier Lee Rigby

A tribute to Fusilier Lee Rigby will lead this year’s Manchester Day Parade on Sunday – which organisers have dedicated to his memory.

Manchester council’s city centre spokesman has announced that the whole parade is dedicated to Drummer Rigby’s memory : -

“This is to show that all of Greater Manchester are thinking about him and his family. We have witnessed their terrible pain and the true dignity they have shown in the face of such a cruel and devastating loss.” “He was a soldier and a man the whole area can be proud of and, as an event which represents our whole community, we wanted to show we are standing shoulder to shoulder with them.” ---- “The whole parade is dedicated to Drummer Rigby’s memory.”

Thousands of people are expected to line the streets of the city centre for the event, which starts at Liverpool Road, Castlefield, at 2.00 pm.

Children will lead the parade by carrying portraits of the soldier alongside the Drumline, which will honour his role in the army.

Guest Fri Jul 12, 2013 10:47 pm

BBC News - Lee Rigby: Military funeral for killed soldier

12 July 2013 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-23263754

* RESPECT *

cyfrifia Fri Jan 31, 2014 12:02 am

Michael Adebolajo, or as he prefers to be called, Mujahid Abu Hamza, who murdered soldier Lee Rigby is now lodging an appeal against his conviction.

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/lee-rigby-murder-michael-adebolajo-6647398

Bearing in mind it is proved that Mujahid Abu Hamza committed the murder, what reason does he have to appeal? Presumably to get another media opportunity to express his opinions. Will the British taxpayer be willing to pay for this appeal? Probably. We are a very tolerant nation. Being that tolerant is very expensive and damaging.

Atlas Fri Jan 31, 2014 1:18 am

That's decmocracy. That's what we 'fight' for. That's what makes it worthwhile. Any less and we desecrate (for the want of a less favourable phrase) our fathers and grandfathers generations. Not me. Relative freedoms have a price. When you look around you at others - it's a price well worth paying. Neutral

Hinch Fri Jan 31, 2014 8:54 am

Exactly Atlas. Let him appeal, though leave may be refused if he doesn't meet the criteria.

Our system of justice, when it works, puts us above the kangaroo courts operating in many other countries. Let him have another chance to rant and rave. Nobody's listening.

Everyone should have the right to equal access to the law. It's in Magna Carta and the HRA. After the niceties have been completed, throw away the key.

Chill37 Fri Jan 31, 2014 8:56 am

Spot on Hinch let the due process go through. Then just let him rot in prison.

cyfrifia Fri Jan 31, 2014 1:03 pm

Hinch wrote:Our system of justice, when it works, puts us above the kangaroo courts operating in many other countries. Let him have another chance to rant and rave. Nobody's listening.

To improve and maintain the justice system, more attention needs to be paid to what goes on for many other people, un-noticed, below the media horizon.

In contrast, some high publicity cases exist on a different level, where much time and money is spent repeatedly going over process.

The idea anyone can gain publicity for their views by murdering and using drawn out legal process to repeatedly present their views is very problematic.

From all we know this was a vicious murder, Mujahid Abu Hamza is definitely guilty, and there are no acceptable grounds for appeal, apart from insanity perhaps.

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