Air quality

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Re: Air quality

Post  cyfrifia on Thu Mar 16, 2017 5:00 pm

Not everyone is pleased with the system of fire and finance you describe.

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/bootle-residents-vent-fury-after-12739619


People are furious about so many recycling fires, the toxic smoke, and say they have been started deliberately. Enough is enough, it has to stop.

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Re: Air quality

Post  Atlas on Fri Mar 17, 2017 2:31 pm

Where there is a scheme there is always a schemer -. Technology is as ever a double edged sword. What the people want and what they actually get are always two different things. Let's be logical -. Recycling collections are all well and good providing you have in place adequate facilities to deal with it upon collection. Most places haven't. We send almost half our 'collections' abroad to other countries for 'sorting'. Therefore - ways and means have to be found to deal with the residues. Some operators are just that 'operators' and have their own methods of dealing with the problem and at the same time making it 'pay'. Accidental burnings is just one method whereby everyone (with the exclusion of the local people and the planet) gets what they want. Society is going through what I would call 'a phase' in that the transition towards a modern technological revolution has its hiccups, waste being one of them. Plastics will eventually become a pariah as biodegradable s take over and packaging will be reduced to keep prices down and reduce waste. Even methods of 'destruction' will change in order that the individual household can 'remove' any offending left-overs. It's called 'progress'. The only snag - we shall all have to be patient and await its arrival.Very Happy Very Happy
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Re: Air quality

Post  cyfrifia on Sun Apr 02, 2017 12:12 pm

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/recycling-plan-fires-boss-jailed-12829018

Judge Stuart Driver QC said Kilroe’s offending was "deliberate and for financial gain."

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Re: Air quality

Post  Atlas on Sun Apr 02, 2017 3:23 pm

'Doh'! Surely not! Who would have thought! And he's not on his own. Evil or Very Mad
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Re: Air quality

Post  cyfrifia on Sat Apr 08, 2017 8:10 pm


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Re: Air quality

Post  Atlas on Sun Apr 09, 2017 4:08 pm

They should be prosecuted for bad storage arrangements unless the fire was arson. In which case the first place to look is at home. The Fire Dept people know the score. Time someone blew the whistle and got things done properly.
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Nothing can be done.

Post  cyfrifia on Sun Apr 09, 2017 7:19 pm

Plumes and clouds of toxic black smoke of burning plastic, oil, chemical, industrial and electronic waste of all kinds are an everday part of the British landscape. It's been that way for many years, and increasingly so, a result of how our business, financial, legal, political, economic and regulatory systems are structured and work together. The public accept it, same as heavy traffic and associated fumes, as part of economic activity.

  jocolor All together now: Nothing can be done, nothing can be done, no-thing, no-thing, can be done!

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Re: Air quality

Post  Atlas on Mon Apr 10, 2017 3:44 pm

Laws, regulation and policing that are fit for purpose. Where there's a will -. But there's not the money and nobody works for nothing. Sad world - but that's the reality. Sad Surprised Surprised Surprised Surprised
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Re: Air quality

Post  cyfrifia on Mon Jul 31, 2017 11:01 am


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Re: Air quality

Post  Atlas on Mon Jul 31, 2017 3:00 pm

A industry that only works on 'profits'. This country hasn't the re-cycling facilities for all its collections and consequently becomes, as we used to say, ithered with the bloody stuff. Accidental fires reduce the over capacity to manageable proportions - until the next time. It's not rocket science. So the answer is - - more recycling depots etc -. NO. The answer is - less unnecessary packaging, less plastic production (only biodegradable allowed), a return to glass containers which are useful to recycle and carry the 'old' deposit' system to ensure 90% returns. Better white goods recycling - and - new incinerators that pour out less carbon etc etc. But of course you cannot stop 'progress' regardless of the harm it often does. New ways will have to found to ensure new products are manageable for the future.Crying or Very sad Evil or Very Mad Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Wink
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Re: Air quality

Post  cyfrifia on Mon Jul 31, 2017 6:09 pm

Have the plastic panels removed from tower blocks been sent to burn at the plastics recycling dump?

There does seem a growing awareness plastic packaging, bags, bottles and so on is destroying the enviironment. Someone has calculated that at this rate, there will be more plastic than fish in the oceans in a few years time.

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Re: Air quality

Post  Atlas on Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:59 pm

One would hope not. There is a grand misconception regarding these panels. Used alone, as in without other materials and expansion/ventilation gaps, these panels are relatively safe and burn very slowly if ignited. Used on less than four storey buildings and as described above they are relatively safe and useful. They are (or were) of American manufacture and the regulations regarding them, in America, forbid their use over 90ft and were never designed to have backing materials included in the construction. For whatever reason these 'recommendations' have been ignored over here and the result has been a less than responsible attitude to their distribution and usage. I have no doubt that the inquiry into Grenfell will expose these incomprehensible decisions and some body somewhere is going to have a very hard time wriggling out from beneath the 'fall-out'.

As usual the 'plastic' age coupled with the fossil fuel age ultimately produces those unforeseen irritants as man and his progressive rape of the planet progresses. Ocean cleansing, of the removable detritus, will proceed as the century moves on and the oceans will ultimately die from acid accumulations regardless of what man tries to do to manually cleans the contents. That is unless man's ingenuity can quickly produce an effective method of carbon-capture and storage and all nations initiate a comprehensive programme sometime in the next 10 -20 years. This will slow down the global warming to acceptable levels (i.e. liveable) and allow time then to move to less harmful methods of production and commerce. But I'm not holding my breath. And fortunately - it won't be 'my' problem.Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Wink Wink
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Re: Air quality

Post  cyfrifia on Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:19 pm

A lot of people affected by a cloud of gas on the south coast yesterday, with breathing difficulties, stinging eyes and vomiting. It smelled of chlorine, but, apparently, nobody knows what it was or where it came from.

Meanwhile the toxic waste fires continue, Merseyside is bad. Evil or Very Mad

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Re: Air quality

Post  Atlas on Mon Aug 28, 2017 2:48 pm

There seems little point in collecting to recycle if at the end of the day it is being 'burned' by 'accidental' fires. The law, as always, is slow to react and catch up and until they do the 'accidental' fires will continue in depots over-stretched with storage.

Various possibilities regarding chemical haze over the White Cliffs. One and most probable a small tanker passing through the 'Straights' washing out its tanks - - highly illegal - but with up to 100 vessels in the area at the time it will take some sifting by the Coast Guard to pinpoint the culprit. Two - chemical release from WW2 munitions dumped offshore in the 1950's. Three - rupture of tanks belonging to shipwrecks - possibly again WW2 wrecks. Four - methane and carbon-monoxide release from trapped settlement on the mantle which could only happen with underwater landslip or earthquake. And five, but already ruled out, wind swept from Northern France probably from a Camembert factory. We shall have to wait and - ponder -.Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes
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Re: Air quality

Post  cyfrifia on Thu Aug 31, 2017 1:43 pm

Probably something like you describe, but not sorted out very well, no-one even knows what the chemical was, never mind where it came from. With Islamical terrorist attacks throughout Europe, and beyond, an everyday occurance now, as well as the usual toxic chemical spills, accidents and fires from industry, commerce and agriculture; the Health and Safety Executive need to sharpen up their act.

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Re: Air quality

Post  Atlas on Thu Aug 31, 2017 2:46 pm

As I keep telling you a 10% wastage of the world's population is mandatory for every generation and given the upsurge in discontent across the globe one can add a further 10% to that. Ergo - a quarter of every generation will be removed worldwide either by way of accident, war, decease or natural calamities. Just keep out of the way yourself - if you can. To attempt to go against the common cause, i.e. survival of 75% of the species, by trying to add by way of policing and sanction will only exacerbate the matter. Best let sleeping dogs lie and hope you survive yourself. With the 75% we already have sufficient survivors to contend with. Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes
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Re: Air quality

Post  cyfrifia on Thu Aug 31, 2017 11:35 pm

As global population grows, mass casualties to war and famine etc., are accepted as everyday news. Your advice to accept this and keep out of the way of deadly disasters is commonsense. The British habit is to talk about the weather. When the weather is toxic plumes and climate change, the same habit applies. Health and safety gets a bad press, but could and should be applied more sensibly to protect the population in a realistic way.




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Re: Air quality

Post  Atlas on Fri Sep 01, 2017 4:14 pm

Could -? At what cost? Should - ? At what cost? Everything has a cost. The more costs the less there's left over - until one day - there's nothing left over - and as mother would say - what about a rainy day? I don't aspire towards penury and thus have never been an advocate of 'seeing' to everything because it 'should' be or 'could' be seen to. The law is already in place to 'attend' to dangerous storages and apart from 'arson' it 'should' be applied. If it isn't then that is the fault of the authorities who we all know are pretty useless at most things logical. Quite often it falls to the 'little people' to ensure good practice is instituted and quite often this is the way forward. One raises 'hell' with the responsible authorities and becomes such a nuisance that they 'do' something about the problem just to get some peace. I rest my case -. Wink Rolling Eyes Wink Rolling Eyes Wink Rolling Eyes Wink Rolling Eyes
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Re: Air quality

Post  cyfrifia on Tue Oct 03, 2017 7:59 pm


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Re: Air quality

Post  Atlas on Wed Oct 04, 2017 2:36 pm

It was in an effort to determine whether or not the asbestos residues were leaching from the buildings and if so at what rate and quantity. The problem with the Turner site is quite beyond RMBC's abilities both in the buildings and the contaminated grounds etc. As has been quite apparent for the last few decades. However - the problem will now get worse as the buildings themselves begin to deteriorate and collapse in on themselves through lack of attention etc etc. We have discussed this just recently on the Facebook thingie and the consensus of opinions have concluded that many millions will have to be found to make the site 'safe' and the problem there is 'who finds the millions'? Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes
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Re: Air quality

Post  cyfrifia on Wed Oct 04, 2017 11:39 pm

A very complicated story to comprehend, but yes, the main message does seem to be failure of government either local or national to do much about it. So probably best just avoid the area, especially in dry, dusty weather.
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Re: Air quality

Post  Atlas on Thu Oct 05, 2017 2:44 pm

No. Not especially. During the manufacturing from 1900 - 1960 the residual dust and fibres were everywhere across the town - depending on the wind direction. I remember walking up Ings Lane having spotted the white roofs of the houses from off Spotland Road long before reaching the bridge and continuing to my aunts house where the washing was being 'batted' on the line to remove the dust articles that had settled thereon. Amazingly the incidences of 'asbestosis' as we called it were small in number considering the pollution that came from the factory during all that time. So - you do really have to take on board the latent 'dangers' that still exist and get on with your life. There are so, so many other ways to die in this crazy world - so balls to it and keep smiling. Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes
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Re: Air quality

Post  cyfrifia on Thu Oct 05, 2017 3:12 pm

Now it's lying around rather than being manufactured, it's most dangerous if disturbed. Rainwater tends to keep things 'damped down', so it seems logical that in dry, windy weather, or, in and after a fire, is when asbestos fibres will blow about?

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Re: Air quality

Post  Atlas on Sat Oct 07, 2017 2:00 pm

If left undisturbed by human intervention the resultant particles will be very few in number and the chances of being breathed in by anything almost zero. However as before stated - age and time and buildings laced with the stuff can only bring forth the day when the problem will become 'vital' to eradicate. Something will have to be done soon -. But who pays?

Other asbestos clad buildings elsewhere will have to be dealt with as needs must. We have doing this now for at least 50 years and will have to continue to do so for another 50 years until the 'brown and blue' has been removed from the environment. Just another 'man-made mistake' amongst so many others. That's life -. Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes
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Re: Air quality

Post  cyfrifia on Sat Oct 07, 2017 10:11 pm

Do not disturb is a good motto, but not everyone recognises it when they see it.
https://www.asbestosnetwork.com/Asbestos-Use/Asbestos-Products.shtml

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