Will you Vote ?

Jeanie Mon Oct 22, 2012 10:16 pm

So will you vote on the 15th November for the Police Crime & Chief Commissionaire ?
One man to take control of the whole force how on earth can one person do this ?
What do we know of the candidates ?
What chance have we had to question any of them regarding safe guarding our areas ?
I personally think the whole thing is a complete farce!
Will I vote on the 15th November I don't think so Mad

teamplayer2 Mon Oct 22, 2012 10:19 pm

Yes Jeanie a complete XXXX up. I have seen nothing of any candidate yet and what is it all about?

Poppyanna555 Mon Oct 22, 2012 10:36 pm

Not sure whether I will vote or not yet, i'm waiting for the booklet to arrive that will tell me more. Must admit, as it stands at the moment I haven't a clue what it's all about, it seems to have come out of nowhere!

Guest Mon Oct 22, 2012 10:39 pm

No I wont vote and, very surprisingly, this is after reading an article from a former Chief of the Met Police. He has rationalised the scenario and called for a national boycott.

No one man or woman should have this authority.

I would perhaps have had a bit more interest if proven leaders of business-industry had been invited to 'pitch' in. It seems Independents are out of the frame and an individual Councillor's cost of standing is estimated at £50k plus. Where's this money coming from? Party political coffers and donations?

The appointment in Gtr Manchester even seems to be a 'Done Deal' politically, with a favoured M/C Central Labour candidate giving up his MP's seat now, so that he can concentrate on being a full time Commissioner. I am TOTALLY opposed to the politicisation of the police and it seems to have increased with successive governments. Compliant media publicity "twists" have compounded this.

Remarkably, I have read that each local Authority in AGMA could also see the appointment of Assistant Commissioners for each borough in the future !

Jeanie Mon Oct 22, 2012 10:59 pm

Mojo Hill wrote:No I wont vote and, very surprisingly, this is after reading an article from a former Chief of the Met Police. He has rationalised the scenario and called for a national boycott.

No one man or woman should have this authority.

I would perhaps have had a bit more interest if proven leaders of business-industry had been invited to 'pitch' in. It seems Independents are out of the frame and an individual Councillor's cost of standing is estimated at £50k plus. Where's this money coming from? Party political coffers and donations?

The appointment in Gtr Manchester even seems to be a 'Done Deal' politically, with a favoured M/C Central Labour candidate giving up his MP's seat now, so that he can concentrate on being a full time Commissioner. I am TOTALLY opposed to the politicisation of the police and it seems to have increased with successive governments. Compliant media publicity "twists" have compounded this.

Remarkably, I have read that each local Authority in AGMA could also see the appointment of Assistant Commissioners for each borough in the future !

I totally agree Mad

Atlas Tue Oct 23, 2012 1:28 am

Such 'posts' are not supposed to be political. Commissioners are supposed to play a neutral part in the job they are being given to do and not favour any party or faith etc. It is supposed to be about communication. Drawing the disparate parts together and overseeing the work the 'local' police force does. Is it a good idea? I don't know. Does it work well in America - anybody got any input as to how they view the 'post' over there? It is also replacing (as I understand it) the present police committees ???????

Chill37 Tue Oct 23, 2012 7:47 am

Dont think I will either. Only started hearing about this the other week. I dont see the point in introducing a new level of management/pen pusher.

Charly Tue Oct 23, 2012 8:08 am

I dont like the way we have been given no information about those putting themselves forward for the job. There is only a direction to a website, what of those people who dont have a PC or not near a library, how do they find out?
I wont be bothering to find out who is standing so wont be voting. And as Chill says, who needs another level of management?

Chill37 Tue Oct 23, 2012 8:29 am

I'm sure I read over the weekend a candidate for this role in Bedfordshire got arrested at a demo.

Hinch Tue Oct 23, 2012 10:04 am

Not sure if I will vote yet but if I do, it won't be along party lines unless there is an Official Monster Raving Loony candidate.

I think this process is very flawed and only supports those with party political backing.

HOWEVER, in the wake of the stuff coming in about Hillsborough and Orgreave... not to mention the Rochdale grooming fiasco, anything that may inject greater accountability into policing would be very welcome but so far, I see nothing in the process that would necessarily guarantee this.

My overall impression is that its not been thought through carefully and is basically just a load of political hogwash wrapped up as policy.

past it Tue Oct 23, 2012 10:12 am

This is a government initiative which enjoys coalition support, a rare event these days. There's been plenty of of information in the newspapers and discussion on TV. Any member of the public can stand for office. I don't know whether it will work or not because it has not been done before in UK. The nearest model would be Boris Johnson who was elected to be mayor of London, that of course was political.
The new police commissioners are supoposed to be given a mandate to have an effect on the way policing happens in their area by taking note of local problems and tackling them in different ways. Their strength will lie with the power of the electorate behind them.
Criticism of the police centres on their structure which makes them virtually self governing, the new commissioner will have the power to hire and fire and should change things in the way the public want.
We will have to await the outcome. I imagine the sucessful candidate will receive criticism and praise depending on who he/she is and how they are perceived politically, that is the way of things. I also imagine those who do not vote will still become critics, again that is the way of things.

Charly Tue Oct 23, 2012 11:51 am

I dont know if any member of the public can put themselves forward, I think its only those who can find the £5K deposit

Jeanie Tue Oct 23, 2012 12:18 pm

It seems experts have already predicted a low turn out to the polls!

The five candidates

Matt Gallagher served 30 years with GMP as a front line inspector tactical aid unit -Lib Dem

Tony Lloyd Manchester Central MP --Labour

Michael Winstanley former Mayor of Wigan,& councillor --Conservative

Steven Woolfe Lawyer and Party Spokesman for Business & finance -- UKIP

Roy Warren Trafford Former magistrate --Independant.

The winning person will start on £100,000 a year salary to set priorities,administer the forces budget and have the power to hire & fire the chief constable.

Guest Tue Oct 23, 2012 12:33 pm

hinch wrote: Not sure if I will vote yet but if I do, it won't be along party lines unless there is an Official Monster Raving Loony candidate.

I think this process is very flawed and only supports those with party political backing.

HOWEVER, in the wake of the stuff coming in about Hillsborough and Orgreave... not to mention the Rochdale grooming fiasco, anything that may inject greater accountability into policing would be very welcome but so far, I see nothing in the process that would necessarily guarantee this.

My overall impression is that its not been thought through carefully and is basically just a load of political hogwash wrapped up as policy.

The Police and Crime Commissioner will be one of the most powerful jobs in the region.

Each candidate can spend up to £356,204. on campaigning!

Politicians are standing for the post and political parties are putting up candidates like Jeanie writes

Extracted:

Q Who will scrutinise the new Police Crime Commissioners?

A The Government are also setting up Police and Crime Panels. In Greater Manchester the panel will include the Salford elected mayor and the party political leaders of the other nine councils, plus two independent members.

Hinch Tue Oct 23, 2012 12:46 pm

Charly wrote:I dont know if any member of the public can put themselves forward, I think its only those who can find the £5K deposit

Absolutely Charly and also have thousands to spend on mailshots which only well-resourced political parties can afford. The whole process seems designed to ensure that only the very rich or those with party-political backing stand any real chance of being elected.

No wonder it has the 'coalition support' that Past It mentions.

I really do think it needs a lot more thought. At first they seemed keen to get genuinely independent candidates but then came up with a process that would virtually exclude any such person.

Also, I do wonder just how the reality... or advisability of these 'hire and fire' powers really works in practice?

As said, I really am in favour of greater police accountability. At the moment they just seem to do and say what the hell they want. I know they have Police Authorities overseeing things but by and large, many of these seem like toothless tigers.

I expect an amazingly low-turnout brought about not only by the usual voter-apathy but also because there seems to be a genuine belief and concern that this just won't deliver the goods and its only real purpose will be is to provide some favoured party apparatchik with a fat salary and an important-sounding job-title.

UP THE DALE Tue Oct 23, 2012 1:48 pm

Chill37 wrote:I'm sure I read over the weekend a candidate for this role in Bedfordshire got arrested at a demo.

Deputy leader of the EDL. They were allegedly were on their way to "protest" at a Mosque, but were (thankfully) intercepted by the police. They were in a back of a removal type van.

The same rich backers of the EDL also are thought to finance this relevantly new neo Nazi organisation. Their numbers are very small.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-20033157

The leader of the EDL is currently in prison. EDL obviously a group of law abiding people.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-20031698

UP THE DALE Tue Oct 23, 2012 1:59 pm

More on Lennon/Robinson. Very busy man. Sat morning along with 4 others attacks a man-what a brave man he is (not). Saturday afternoon gets arrested with 52 other thickos who are attempting to attack a Mosque and then gets charged for entering the US on a false passport. Hopefully he will be sent to the US.

http://www.lutontoday.co.uk/news/local/edl-leader-arrested-over-assault-1-4396265

Regarding the police commissioner role, I think the present system should have been kept, but with the police authority being given a lot more power.

Chill37 Tue Oct 23, 2012 3:04 pm

More to the point who are the candidates for our neck of the woods?

Ann M Tue Oct 23, 2012 7:04 pm

Yes, I will be voting.

It comes as no surprise that I will be supporting MICHAEL WINSTANLEY. Wink

Jeanie Tue Oct 23, 2012 9:36 pm

Ann M wrote:Yes, I will be voting.

It comes as no surprise that I will be supporting MICHAEL WINSTANLEY.

We will still be friends Ann Wink

But sad to say I won't be voting because I totally disagree that this will be of benefit to anyone it has been rushed & pushed through with minimum of information to the voters.
I would have liked an answer & question time for such an important (expensive) post ?
I want to know if closing our local police stations is really such a good idea?
I really want to know "Are there plans to close Littleborough Police Station"?
Will the response time be adequate if this is the case ?
Just as they have done with our Hospital and Healthcare in Rochdale why have we not had an opportunity to ask questions and challenge such an important issue ?

Guest Tue Oct 23, 2012 9:57 pm

Ann M wrote:Yes, I will be voting.

It comes as no surprise that I will be supporting MICHAEL WINSTANLEY.

Ann: We know he’s employed in the NHS and is a member of the Campaign for Real Ale, but his Wigan experience hardly gives him the know-how to determine priorities for Rochdale …. same with the others.

I’m exasperated at the thought that any future Commissioner will be advised by this town’s council leader, (or his nominee!) on some kind of new crime panel. Like the present leader’s knowledge of the constituency didn’t extend to Corporate Parenting deficiencies, ergo where would he get his own advice from? : The GMP and its own management-led versions of accountability

These new politicised police Supremos will lack democratic legitimacy.

Lancs Police Authority commissioned a group called "The Lancashire Hotpots" to record a song on You Tube to raise awareness of the elections! Five flat caps suggest you might as well laugh about it. Smile

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1OvofYwF2FU&feature=youtu.be

Charly Tue Oct 23, 2012 10:00 pm

Jeanie, I thought Littleborough Police Station was already closed?

past it Tue Oct 23, 2012 10:26 pm

The sucessful candidate for Greater Manchester will have a large area to cover. I don't know how much consultation has taken place but I suspect that most people will vote along party political lines. There is an independant standing.

One news item in today's Times editorial has persuaded me to vote. The former Metropolitan Police Commissioner Ian Blair now Lord Blair of Boughton, in a TV interview advised the public to scupper the elections by not bothering to vote. The Times comments: "It is hard to imagine a more naked display of contempt for the role of the public in policing" The Times goes on to say "It would be richly deserved,and a welcome legacy,if the upshot of his comments were to encourage people,fired up by his patronising contempt,to go out and vote".

If anyone wonders whether to vote or not that should convince them to do so.

Jeanie Tue Oct 23, 2012 10:41 pm

Charly wrote:Jeanie, I thought Littleborough Police Station was already closed?

No it's not closed Charly they did close the front office a few months ago but you can still go I just dread to think what will happen in the Pennines if they do close it altogether ?

It was thought at one time to put the Doctors surgery in there along with council offices and the library which in my opinion would have been a good idea ?
But the Doctors surgery is going through a major refurbish now I dread to think of the future of our Pennines Police Force ?

Jeanie Tue Oct 23, 2012 10:48 pm

past it wrote: The sucessful candidate for Greater Manchester will have a large area to cover. I don't know how much consultation has taken place but I suspect that most people will vote along party political lines. There is an independant standing.

One news item in today's Times editorial has persuaded me to vote. The former Metropolitan Police Commissioner Ian Blair now Lord Blair of Boughton, in a TV interview advised the public to scupper the elections by not bothering to vote. The Times comments: "It is hard to imagine a more naked display of contempt for the role of the public in policing" The Times goes on to say "It would be richly deserved,and a welcome legacy,if the upshot of his comments were to encourage people,fired up by his patronising contempt,to go out and vote".

If anyone wonders whether to vote or not that should convince them to do so.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion ? why should this make you go out and vote or convince you ?

Sponsored content

Will you Vote ?

Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Vote

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?

Re: Will you Vote ?