Firemen bricked!

Thanks. Ha,ha just noticed Up The DOLE, excellent.

Jeanie wrote:From being raised on Cloverhall I have never understood why the top half Bellshill have never mixed I had loads of friends in both areas so I can't answer your question because I don't understand the reason why there is such a friction !

It goes back a long time, Jean. When I lived on Belfield as a boy in the sixties, it was the lower end that was undesirable, due in large part to a very notorious gang of thugs.

UP THE DALE wrote: .

In what way am I getting personal with members of this forum? If someone posts something I disagree with me, I am entitled to question what they say. People post things often with no foundation. I am sure Admin will tell me the moment I go over the top-not happened yet.

It's OK UTD. A bit of 'cut and thrust is fine and you have not come even close to breaking any rules. It would be a boring forum indeed if we all saw eye to eye on everything.

We would only ever remove posts that we felt were potentially libellous or which set out to deliberately offend, cause distress or were malicious.

Debate and discussions do get heated at times. No problem. I would be far more worried if we acted as if we were all one big, twee, happy family.

Both here and on the old RO forums it has been good to see issues involving race and immigration being properly discussed and debated. Perhaps the country as a whole has suffered from a lack of this? This to my mind has encouraged mistrust and polarisation.

Thanks Admin. I agree with what you say. There does have to be different view points put forward, otherwise this MB would not reflect real life. Agree that we should talk about sometimes controversial issues, like race, religion, abortion etc.

The driver of the fire engine said "There was a gang of around 12 youths, who looked to be around 16, swearing at us and shouting before they started to throw bricks."

http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/s/1593029_video-thousands-make-bonfire-night-a-sparkling-occasion-throughout-greater-manchester

It's bad enough for fit and healthy firefighters who have an almost armored fire engine to get back into, but I can see why anyone elderly or sensible would not want to go out on the street at night there, and with gangs like that around.

Admin wrote:Both here and on the old RO forums it has been good to see issues involving race and immigration being properly discussed and debated. Perhaps the country as a whole has suffered from a lack of this? This to my mind has encouraged mistrust and polarisation.

Taking that as an invitation to ask a question, answer may be obvious to those who know, but not to me, an occasional visitor into Rochdale.

Each time I come into town, there seem more asian faces and businesses, using the word asian because I don't know exactly where people are from. These people seem more high profile, confident, sometimes a bit aggressive, and the white British people look fewer, unhappier, more subdued.

What does the future hold for Rochdale, will it become a mainly asian town eventually? Do asian people really like it and want to make something of it, or will it carry on in a neither one thing nor the other sort of way?

Where are you going to Rochdale? Is there a sense of direction?

cyfrifia wrote:

Admin wrote:Both here and on the old RO forums it has been good to see issues involving race and immigration being properly discussed and debated. Perhaps the country as a whole has suffered from a lack of this? This to my mind has encouraged mistrust and polarisation.

"Taking that as an invitation to ask a question, answer may be obvious to those who know, but not to me, an occasional visitor into Rochdale.

Each time I come into town, there seem more asian faces and businesses, using the word asian because I don't know exactly where people are from. These people seem more high profile, confident, sometimes a bit aggressive, and the white British people look fewer, unhappier, more subdued."



What does the future hold for Rochdale, will it become a mainly asian town eventually? Do asian people really like it and want to make something of it, or will it carry on in a neither one thing nor the other sort of way?

Where are you going to Rochdale? Is there a sense of direction?

Not really been that much change in the number of ethnic minorities from the Asian sub continent in the last few years. Most immigration has been from eastern Europe. I don't think there is any more aggression from from them than "white British people". The reason why there is more un happiness if there is, is due to the lowering of living standards, lack of decent jobs etc. Despite this, most Rochdalians are usually still positive, and friendly.


I honestly don't think there will be much of a change. Currently there is about 20% Muslim population, and going off the rate of increase of the last few years it would take decades at least for Muslims to become the majority. Maybe an increase would benefit the town. No idea what Muslims think, except most just wan to get on with their lives and more and more of them say they are British. A large number were born in this town, and thus are part of this town.

Over recent years, there appears to be an increase in asian faces on the streets, might be just appearances. Maybe they get out and about more.

The race, or culture issue seems unavoidably on the agenda, how it develops could go either way, hopefully positive.

The aggression I notice is mainly aggressive drivers.

Yes, poverty and unemployment make people look miserable, but, is that all there is to it?

Rochdalians I've met have been very nice people, but usually have a poor impression of the way things are for Rochdale. Seems a bit sad, as though something went wrong somewhere.

I too have little clue what Muslims think, ones I've known do have different priorities in life. Some of the younger men often seem resentful or angry, it's a matter of degree, fairly normal with teenagers. Maybe that energy might turn to more useful things in time.

Can't say a visit to Rochdale is a very pleasant experience, I'd like to see a brighter future appearing for the town, but it does all look a bit expensive to sort out.

As said before, it's down to the people who live there to determine how things will be. I'm curious to know what ideas people may have about the future for Rochdale. More of the same seems a bit uninspired.

I suppose the future will just happen and be nothing to do with what people might forsee or plan, the future does tend to be like that.

The increase is mostly the birth and growing up of Rochdale born and bred Muslims, and how many you see will be a case of where you are and or whether you are noticing the appearance of people or the fact that they are people.

The issues of race and culture are not usually on the agenda, apart from when people want to stir things up. Obviously it has arisen due to the fact that the monsters in the recent local child grooming cases have been Muslim, but I await to see the full facts before believing that they committed those crimes because of their religion and or culture, either partly or fully-the jury is still out on that.

I don't USUALLY notice aggressive drivers, it's the vehicles they drive I tend to notice. Personally I have NOT noticed any particular group of drivers being any more aggressive than any others.

Why, what other reasons will these people have to be unhappy. I would guess, many different reasons, if you have an idea why, please tell us. Probably the same reasons that make people unhappy in Rochdale make people unhappy in Todmorden, personal/family problems, financial, work etc etc.

Muslim youth are any more angry than any other youth, unless it's in response to bigots trying to stir things up in a racist way, or being treated differently, despite in the main being born and bred in Rochdale and trying to be westernised or fit in. The majority of youth, including Muslim youth are very well behaved and not aggressive. There is not a massive race war happening, despite what some might think.

If you don't like your visits to Rochdale then the best thing to do is don't come. It will take a lot of time and money to sort things help. Things are happening that will hopefully make things better.

Don't worry too much about us Rochdalians.

UP THE DALE wrote:
If you don't like your visits to Rochdale then the best thing to do is don't come.

Are you that chap that works voluntary at the Tourist Office?

cyfrifia wrote:

UP THE DALE wrote:
If you don't like your visits to Rochdale then the best thing to do is don't come.

Are you that chap that works voluntary at the Tourist Office?

No, but I am not a fool who visits a town then spends hours complaining about it, but keeps going back to see it.

Hinch wrote:Yes, he's the one wearing the 'Happy to Help' badge who says, "Have a nice day!"

I wish.

I don't try to portray the town to be any worse or better than what it actually is. Some outsiders though think they know everything about the town because of what they might read in the press, internet etc when in fact they nothing really, and try to stir things up, making things even worse. At least you Hinch have a decent idea of what's going on, and have a fairly balanced view of the town.

cyfrifia wrote:

UP THE DALE wrote:
If you don't like your visits to Rochdale then the best thing to do is don't come.

Are you that chap that works voluntary at the Tourist Office?

That chap is 1 of the inner town's self-appointed community leaders; wears an authority mantle and talks for others. You're welcome and dont need to add sycophantic comment

This weeks top poster, Up The Dale, does seem a bit over-sensitive about people who live outside the town commenting on events and what goes on there, and there may be a reason or explanation for that over-sensitivity, probably after right wing groups demonstrating in the town has added to upset.

It's surprising how isolated from each other a lot of the towns of the north west of England are from each other, with reasonably good transport links, but each tends to be it's own little world, like parallel universes.

I have no problem with people from outside the the area commenting about events happening in the town, but in your case it's always negative. I merely pointed out that IF I did not like a place I would not keep going there voluntarily, and then spend lots of time moaning about it.

UP THE DALE wrote:I have no problem with people from outside the the area commenting about events happening in the town, but in your case it's always negative.

I don't think my comments are always negative, you have a different personality and view of things than I do. I accept that, it's just the way the world is. Can't you do the same? I'm happy to debate ideas and opinions but, UTD, your approach of personal criticism isn't the right way to go about things. Smiley face

They are negative when it comes to talking about Rochdale, especially regarding a certain section of the community. I have a balanced view about Rochdale, and I express both positive and negative views about Rochdale. I don't find excuses to rubbish Rochdale like you seem to do. Something must lie behind your seemingly hatred of the town. I have debated many things with you and others, and answered many of your points about the things you have said, including on this thread when you tried to make out that all "Asian" drivers are aggressive, and all "Asian youth" are aggressive. Do you not like "Asian" people? Of course I will get personal if I am responding to a person's comments . If you don't like the answers don't ask the question.

Firefighters are dealing with a spill of what is believed to be hydrochloric acid gas at Trafford Park.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-20371841

No reports of bricks being thrown or any other attacks on firefighters there.