Horsemeat.

Anyone who both has a heart and is aware, will feel some compassion for the suffering of the animals we farm, use and slaughter.

Just a thought how many times have we said in jest "I am so hungry I could eat a horse " or a (Scabby Cat)

Joking apart I really do not want a "scabby cat" chow mien !

I am defo going Veggie just hope my "broccoli isn't turned white disguised as cauliflower"

There were some misgivings reported in the press about the Todmorden Slaughterhouse.

http://www.todmordennews.co.uk/news/local/slaughterhouse-gets-the-go-ahead-1-1840000

But, the owner insists he has done nothing wrong.

Local slaughterhouses are indeed more humane. At the moment there is no published evidence of wrongdoing.

They appear to be misgivings from people who basically didn't want a slaughterhouse in the area, though, nothing else.

Dalelad wrote:They appear to be misgivings from people who basically didn't want a slaughterhouse in the area, though, nothing else.

It's in quite a remote place. For slaughterhouses generally to come under scrutiny, despite being remote, is a good thing.

Hinch wrote:Have to say that I wish they did sell horsemeat widely in the UK as I enjoy it. Needless to say I would wish it to be slaughtered humanely and labelled correctly.

I think it is the majority thinking Hinch.

Me and my better half went to Heskin Hall today for the farm shop and craft shops. Had lunch there today and I had Beef stew with a bread roll.

I cracked a joke saying how nice the beef stew was but I found the horse shoe a bit hard to chew on in the stew. I think they were not amused by the looks they gave me.

Though it was a nice stew.

I think we fool ourselves into believing our food chain is humane, I don't believe it is.

Terrible suffering, in the vast majority of cases, goes into that slice of flesh on your plate.

Most of us find the truth too dreadful to think about so we don't. We turn a blind eye and convince ourselves we live in an humane society and no suffering was involved in our nicely packaged product.

Spot on Spartacus.

Well, I've been to do my monthly shop today. I rarely buy frozen food anyway though I am quite partial to fish fingers but today, I found myself scurrying past the frozen food aisles and came home with no frozen goods at all.

I'm sure I will revert to type in time, as will most others.

Having been both a butcher and slaughterman as my primary trade. I can assure you all - you are absolutely correct. They are hell-holes. Happy eating.

There are good farmers, who insist on going to the slaughterhouse and watching their animals being killed. They do that because they know there is otherwise no proper inspection, to go and see for yourself is the only way.

cyfrifia wrote:There are good farmers, who insist on going to the slaughterhouse and watching their animals being killed. They do that because they know there is otherwise no proper inspection, to go and see for yourself is the only way.

And see what? Do you suppose for one micro-second that the animal is any less fearful of its new unfamiliar surroundings and unfamiliar human faces or - and here is the nub of the matter - the smell of death. Do not for one second believe animals do not feel fear or apprehension in such circumstances. They do. I've seen it. I will repeat - there is no 'humane' way of 'killing' a cognisant creature whatever way you may wrap up the trimmings around it. A slaughterhouse is just that - a hell-hole. Especially if you're the lamb. I am a meat eater and always will be. But unlike many, I'm not under any misplaced misapprehensions or silly illusions.

Atlas wrote:And see what?

Just that the slaughter is done without unnecessary cruelty. Of course animals always suffer to some extent, but as we see in the news, and from hidden cameras, there is sometimes mistreatment of animals, and that at least might be stopped.

I won't attempt to defend unnecessary cruelty but you are hardly dealing with compassion here. Where you have people prepared to exact such dealings you must appreciate the 'hardness' that goes with it or to put it more succinctly - the hardness that becomes the norm with constant unremitting killing. As an example I will give you one that may horrify you -.

During 1940 -41 the Sonndercommando Units sent into Poland to eradicate the Jewish population, some 2 million, were, after a couple of weeks, given copious amounts of Schnapps to keep them semi-inebriated to enable them to carry out their daily murder quotas. Seeing this method beginning to fail over a period of time the SS quickly developed more 'efficient' methods of disposal, not to be more humane, but to save the poor German/Ukrainian/Polish executioners from 'undue stress'. Hence the Gas-Vans, the 'Explosion' method both of which ultimately lead to the specially designed Gas-Chambers etc of the Death-Camps. Whilst we are prepared to act like 'parasitic beasts' one must expect a certain latitude of uncaring. Sorry - but there it is.

Yes, Atlas, what you explain there is familiar, the brutalising effect of war and similar experiences, and, yes, you are right, we can expect "a certain latitude of uncaring" in people.

That's why we can anticipate, that without proper inspection and supervision there will be unnecessary cruelty in farming and slaugherhouses.

It's not enough to rely on hoping for the best, we do need better systems in place to cover that reality. That applies not only to the welfare of animals, but to the care of people as well.

As population increases, social conditions change, and austerity bites, there is ever more need for political, legal and regulatory systems to work quickly, fairly and thoroughly. All these systems have been stretched, ignored and devolved, and they were stretched to start with.

The sort of systems I mean are planning systems, NHS standards of care, the care system, the law courts, supervision of parliamentary expenses, immigration control, inspection of food outlets, takeaways etc, regulation of taxis, care of the elderly, all the systems that one by one come into the headlines as failing badly.

The culture in public life, of avoiding responsibility and turning a blind eye to things that are too complicated and difficult in favor of spin and political or personal advantage has become too embedded. Either we give up and accept the descent into ever lower standards, and consequences of that, or face up to the reality that so many of our 'systems' are not fit for the purpose of reality, and need sorting out.

Paul McCartney - "If slaughterhouses had glass walls, everyone would be a vegetarian."

Not me!

Nicely typed cyfrifia and well structured. However - the 'descent' into ever lower standards you talk about are not as a result of human emotion but stem from the haves and the have-nots and the ever widening gap which a burgeoning world population and lack of resource and opportunities brings forth. If you are well-off and well cared for your 'life' will, in general terms, be comfortable. You will have no need to adopt the 'law of the jungle' or take to obscenities to survive. You are probably luckier than 80% of the rest of the world's population. To appeal to the human race to give up its propensity towards uncaring/ and or greed will only occur with evolution/time. Give it another 5,000 years and, if all goes well in the meantime, you might just get somewhere near it. But for the present homo-sapien doesn't possess that capacity in sufficient quantities for the aims you are looking for. Try if you want by all means. I wish you well in your endeavors. Meanwhile - if you eat meat then be prepared to accept it is a cruel and obscene trade-off to satisfy your appetite.

Atlas wrote:Nicely typed cyfrifia and well structured. However - the 'descent' into ever lower standards you talk about are not as a result of human emotion but stem from the haves and the have-nots and the ever widening gap which a burgeoning world population and lack of resource and opportunities brings forth. If you are well-off and well cared for your 'life' will, in general terms, be comfortable. You will have no need to adopt the 'law of the jungle' or take to obscenities to survive. You are probably luckier than 80% of the rest of the world's population. To appeal to the human race to give up its propensity towards uncaring/ and or greed will only occur with evolution/time. Give it another 5,000 years and, if all goes well in the meantime, you might just get somewhere near it. But for the present homo-sapien doesn't possess that capacity in sufficient quantities for the aims you are looking for. Try if you want by all means. I wish you well in your endeavors. Meanwhile - if you eat meat then be prepared to accept it is a cruel and obscene trade-off to satisfy your appetite.

Well said, Atlas.

Hinch wrote:I like to think that all the meat I eat comes from nice, smiling, happy animals that live out long and happy lives in the farmyard being pampered and hand-fed daily by the rosy-cheeked farmer's wife. They are then taken to the vet's where they are put to sleep painlessly before being converted into succulent steaks.

Their souls go straight to Heaven where they frolic in a lush meadow for all eternity.

Geddit??????

Well if you are saying this really doesn't happen Hinch then i am truly shocked