Towns worse than Rochdale?

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Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  teamplayer2 on Sun Jun 02, 2013 9:28 am

I have just come back from my holiday in Sussex.

Visiting a couple of areas we came across a couple of towns that made Rochdale look attractive. So I did not feel to bad about Rochdale in the end.

Just as many areas in the south of England that are worse than Rochdale . So why do the media head for all the bad news in the North when it comes to scandals etc?

Seems to me the south has worse problems than us in most cases. Perhaps the South do not like to admit they have the same problems that are worse than here in the North. After all it is a nation wide problem.

If you are in the area in the South East of England. Go and visit Hastings. You will feel much better about Rochdale.

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  Hinch on Sun Jun 02, 2013 9:35 am

Or better still, read Robert Tressel's 'Ragged Trousers Philanthropists '. His fictional town of Mugsborough is based on Hastings.

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  teamplayer2 on Sun Jun 02, 2013 9:37 am

Will do Hinch.

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  Hinch on Sun Jun 02, 2013 9:44 am

Where were you based in Sussex TP? Not been there. We fancy going to Kent next year for Easter. Canterbury, Dover etc.

We usually go to Norfolk at Easter but are going there in August instead. Hopefully I'll have at least one new knee by then which should improve my mobility.

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  cyfrifia on Sun Jun 02, 2013 11:08 am

Hastings has long had a reputation as pretty grim. It's always somehow re-assuring to find that others are worse off that yourself, but, the standard we should really measure by is what we think is reasonable, achievable and acceptable.

We tend to remember towns and places we've been to or heard of as they were when we last saw or heard of them, actually going there and having a look can be quite different.

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  Hinch on Sun Jun 02, 2013 11:20 am

If you want to see real areas of social deprivation, a tour around some of our capital's less well-visited areas will open the eyes of those who think that the South is full of retired stockbrokers. Tower Hamlets and Bermondsey, Southall and Balham being cases in point. As for Peckham, roll up the car windows, put all the door locks on and drive through it as fast as you can.

Doing my stint as a District Nurse down there certainly was an education.

Trying to do a sterile dressing on a patient's festering leg ulcer whilst her dog licked at the wound in a cockroach and rat-ridden hovel certainly had me reassessing my experiences of the north-south divide!

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  Old Regulator on Sun Jun 02, 2013 1:46 pm

Hinch you will find Dover a bit scary at night and an eye soar during day time, just passing through onto the ferries is an education in itself. Matron and I had 3 hours in Canterbury last Friday afternoon, it was packed with school parties from across the channel, very well behaved too. Unfortunately it has its fair share of pillocks mouthing off in several foreign accents but in English, just for my sake? Be warned £3 10p a pint in Spoons, the one nearest the railway station is a better one and just inside the city wall, Westgate. Also not very DDA compliant, okay it is a heritage site so lots of cobbled narrow streets, but even outside the walls there are very few dropped kerbs. Our 2 class 58 locos did us proud.

As for newspapers painting Rochdale in a bad light I think most newspapers these days are regional in their coverage so of course the papers up here concentrate on local stories, Oxford didn’t come out of the latest sex grooming case very well, dreaming spires and all.

The situation is that we have created a section of society which takes its lead from crap newspapers and TV shows aimed at the terminally dim.

As Paul throaux(?) said yesterday morning a traveller doesn’t know where they are going and a tourist doesn’t know where they’ve been.

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  cyfrifia on Sun Jun 02, 2013 8:01 pm

We are used to it, but British housing and towns are not brilliant. Of course some have enough room and a garden, but not everyone.

The UK has the tiniest new build houses even compared to places like Japan and Holland. Our road system is a combination of tight, wriggly roads made for horses and carts, and huge, overloaded, badly designed, noisy, and to many people, frightening, motorways.

It depends where you compare to, but for a supposedly modern country, much of our towns and housing has a 'temporary arrangement' look and feel about it. Bungalows built after the war as emergency temporary housing, are considered to be desirable residences now. Many people are living in caravan type 'park homes' that look like shipping containers.

Our towns appear to be planned by haphazard chance and changing economic circumstance. A lot of people don't have somewhere satisfactory to really live their life as they might like, and as 'Old Regulator' points out, what could otherwise be reasonable places are made unpleasant by people living out the 'shameless' lifestyle with all the anti-social stuff.

In a similar way to how dangerous traffic situations never have anything done about them, because no-one (or not many people) are killed, it still means that everyone constantly has to live with the stress of dangerous traffic, so it is with many aspects of housing, society and so on, it might not be what we would want, but is accepted or put up with as 'the way it is'.

Perhaps my ideas of the sort of UK I would like to live in are too idealistic, if people generally are happy to put up with the sort of standards Hinch describes, in 'some of our capital's less well-visited areas', and think that's ok, and it surprises me, but many people do seem to think that is ok, that's how it will be and will remain, as seems to be the case.

Actually, some people seem to think that areas of poor housing and 'social deprivation' are essential for 'driving the economy', but, where does that idea come from, the political neolithic?

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  Hinch on Sun Jun 02, 2013 11:32 pm

I find one of the most worrying mindsets; often expressed on the forum is the 'Rochdale might be a dump but it's no worse than some other places.'

I refuse to accept mediocrity and squalor as the norm.

I demand the right as a freeborn Englishmen to call a spade a spade and a shithole a shithole.

Nice Town Hall though.

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  teamplayer2 on Thu Jun 06, 2013 8:47 am

Hinch wrote:Where were you based in Sussex TP? Not been there. We fancy going to Kent next year for Easter. Canterbury, Dover etc.

We usually go to Norfolk at Easter but are going there in August instead. Hopefully I'll have at least one new knee by then which should improve my mobility.

Hinch

We were based in Seaford between Brighton and Eastbourne. A small quiet town by the sea. Popular with older people and those wanting a quiet stay by the sea. Though like most areas in recent years due to the financial climate businesses in the area have intended to struggle.

A beech which is flat and easy to get to along the front and free parking. Though the beech is more pebbles than sand. It may not be popular with a lot of people due to the fact it is a quiet place, but there again some people will like that.

Though the area has some nice pubs and restaurants and villages in the area. A good area for history if you like the subject. There are nice homes and gardens worth a visit in the area. A lot of properties owned by the National Trust and English Heritage.

We went visiting Smallhythe Place in Tenterden, Kent. This the home of the famous Victorian Actress Ellen Terry. Also events and plays are held there in the Working Barn Theatre. Some plays with very famous actors taking part. Very popular venue during the summer.

Monk's House in Rodmell near Lewes. The home of the novelist Virginia Woolf is worth a visit.

Though we have been to a lot of the historical places we want to see there are some places not accessible for all for people with disabilities.
There are parking spaces,drop off points, toilets, catering and transfer available for anyone with disabilities. Though it is best to check before you visit. Some of the historical homes and castles you can visit, but for example you cannot get to the upper floors due to the nature of the building. So it was mentioned.

Good local transport along the sea front between Brighton and Eastbourne, also to a lot of the villages in the area. Though gets more difficult in the most remote parts of Sussex and Kent unless you have a car.

Eastbourne nice sea front shame about the town centre, though I did like Brighton. Depends what you want and what you want to see and do.

There are loads of attractions and things to do in the area but depends what you are looking for in an holiday. There are restful places and there are adventurous activities if you like them. Also there is your favourite at the Kent and East Railway Line between Tenderten and Bodiam. An old preserved railway line with your old steam and diesel trains. Also the old preserved railway line at the Romney,Hythe and Dymchurch Railway along the Kent coast.

So Hinch there are things to do in the area good or bad weather depending what you want to do. I wish you well when your replacement Knee Operation happens and hope it helps you to do more in the future. In the future it looks like I will have a problem with my left hip so may have to go through what you have been going through with your knee but in my case an hip replacement. See what happens. Good luck with your Knee op.



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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  Hinch on Thu Jun 06, 2013 9:10 am

Been to Brighton several times on trade union conferences. Nice town with lots of good Fullers and King & Barnes pubs and many great restaurants. I stayed at The Grand last time which was badly run down but has had a refurb since then. A bit too busy for a holiday destination.

I quite fancy seeing the Romney, Hythe and Dymchurch. Light Railway. They had a wonderful armoured train there in WWII. What a great posting.

A handy place for nipping over to France to stock up the wine cellar.

I once went to Eastbourne for an interview. Thankfully I didn't get the job. The place looked grim even then, 35 years ago. Never seen so many wheelchairs and elderly people in one place. I couldn't wait to get away.

I think I'll stick with Norfolk and Kent. We are off to Normandy again for our main jollies this year. Must re-read my Max Hastings and Anthony Beevor books on D-Day. Heading for Colleville Sur Mer to our favourite campsite.

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  teamplayer2 on Thu Jun 06, 2013 9:22 am

At the Kent and East Sussex railway site they have the restored and preserved Cavell Van which was used to carry the Unknown Warrior to his final resting place. Also named after Edith Cavell who was shot by the Germans in World War One. The volunteer at the railway society mentioned to us that it was their pride and joy of their collection. A really touching story of how they saved and preserved it for the nation. I was really proud of the people who saved the carriage for us all to see today.


Sussex is OK and the Sussex Downs I quite like but like Kent over the years there has been a lot of over developement for my liking. Though I have been to Brighton and Eastbourne a few time and also into Kent I think there has been to much over developement along the coast which has ruined a lot of the area along the coast. Also at the expense of a lot of other towns. It is a shame because towns like Eastbourne can be better with a lot of thought, but like Rochdale it depends who runs the town and who wants to take on the task I suppose.

There is a building in Eastbourne run by a Trade Union along the coast but I cannot remember the name of the building. I do have a photograph of it somewhere.

At Eastbourne and other areas round it I intended to see a mixture of elderly and young people but not of greater number of any one group.

Though I did not visit the area 35 years ago then.

I like Norfolk. Been loads of times. I use to have an Uncle I visited there when I was younger who was in the RAF and stationed there for a number of years. Been again in recent years. Great county. If you see me in a pub in Kent or Norfolk, tap me on the shoulder I will buy you a pint of you best beer. A great preserved railway line as well. Next time I am there I will have to look in and see how the railway is doing. Not been for a long time.

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  teamplayer2 on Thu Jun 06, 2013 10:06 am

You would not believe this while I was in Rye in Kent this time last week I ended giving helping an elderly lady who was fainting walking up an hill in the town. Spent sometime with her until more professional help came. At least she seem to recover while we were there. Good deed done for the holiday I suppose along with the help from my good wife. At least we made sure she did not get any worse It all happened so fast it was my wife who spotted her struggling outside this shop.

What got me how many people walked round her before we got there and did not want to help or find out what was wrong with her before we got to her. The young staff from the shop where great who came out to help when they saw what was happening.

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  cyfrifia on Thu Jun 06, 2013 11:29 am

There's no place like home. Many people suffer from feelings of not belonging where they are, a sense of 'alienation' is very common experience. So much a part of modern life that it's a normal thing.

Many students going away to college feel homesick for a while. People who have to move to find work similar. Some like to move to escape their home town. Those who stay where they are, but their home town changes around them can get a similar feeling of disconnect.

Most of us recover from feeling 'homesick', but it is similar to depression, for some people it just becomes part of how they feel all the time, they come to accept it. People have always moved, but in the past a lot of people never did leave their own patch, and places change much quicker now.

Homesick, a strange feeling, a bit like nostalgia, a sort of depression, usually an unhappy feeling. In an increasingly mobile world, will more people feel homesick?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-22764986

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  bluerose on Fri Jun 07, 2013 8:14 pm

Hinch, have you thought about visiting the Isle of Wight Steam Railway?
I have absolutely no technical knowledge relating to locomotives etc!

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  Hinch on Sat Jun 08, 2013 11:53 am

Been to Pompey and Gosport several times Bluerose but never nipped across to the IoW. It's on my 'to-do list'.

Went round it once on an evening cruise but even that was in the dark.

I quite fancy a shuftie at Osborne House.

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  teamplayer2 on Sat Jun 08, 2013 1:30 pm

Put that on my to do list as well. Never done that railway line. Thank you Bluerose for the info.

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  Hinch on Thu Jun 20, 2013 10:55 am

Was placed in a stack on my Aer Lingus 'red-eye' this morning flying in circles above Greater Manchester.

Amazing how nice Rochdale looks from 30,000 feet.

Recognised the town flats and the old Dunlop site but couldn't make out the Entwisle Road urban farm.

Was a bit nervous in case Niall, the pilot flew too low and sucked up any litter into his engine uptakes, went into a stall and had to make an emergency landing in Deeplish. They'd have had his wheels and tyres off before he came to a halt!

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  cyfrifia on Thu Jun 20, 2013 11:24 am

Distance lends enchantment to the view. If you look at these towns created by the industrial revolution, imagine all the buildings gone, the landscape as it was before it was built, and then think, what sort of town and layout could you build here, starting from scratch, for thousands of people to live in; would it be a far, far, better place, or, something similar to what we've got?

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  Hinch on Thu Jun 20, 2013 11:35 am

If you read some of the drivel on other Internet sites, you'd already think that Rochdale was a veritable Shangrila with no problems whatsoever populated by a wonderfully diverse but totally integrated community striving for the common good led by an energetic, caring council made up of talented, altruistic, community - minded citizenry.

All together now, "I'm going back to Rochdale..."

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  cyfrifia on Thu Jun 27, 2013 11:47 pm



With the sentencing today of the Oxford 'grooming' gang, going by what is reported, the crimes in Oxford were 'worse' than in the Rochdale cases. Anything else I have to say on the subject I have deleted before posting.

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  Atlas on Fri Jun 28, 2013 1:17 am







Thus proving that the grass is not always 'greener' elsewhere. Let's be thankfull for small mercies.affraid

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  cyfrifia on Fri Jul 19, 2013 12:56 am

Bradford. This man looks armless, but was jailed for eight years.

The Judge said: “Parents are entitled to expect that when they send their children to have their hair cut, they are not subjected to sexual abuse."

http://www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/news/10539449.Great_Horton_barber_jailed_for_trying_to_rape_boy/?ref=ar


Last edited by cyfrifia on Sat Oct 26, 2013 12:35 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  cyfrifia on Sat Oct 26, 2013 12:34 am

Surveys should always be taken with a pinch of salt, this one says that quality of life in Bradford is lowest in the UK.

http://www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/news/10753327.Quality_of_life_in_Bradford_is_the_worst_in_the_UK___survey/?ref=mc

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Re: Towns worse than Rochdale?

Post  Old Regulator on Sat Oct 26, 2013 12:15 pm

cyfrifia wrote:Surveys should always be taken with a pinch of salt, this one says that quality of life in Bradford is lowest in the UK.

http://www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/news/10753327.Quality_of_life_in_Bradford_is_the_worst_in_the_UK___survey/?ref=mc
The folk in Wetherspoons in Bradford last Wednesday seemed happy enough.  Its called Titus Salt btw.


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